Fuel not booting anymore...

Effediesse

New member
Aug 4, 2020
11
1
3
Northern Italy
New first-time owner of a Fuel here, the machine used to start up and work properly but lately it shows these symptoms:

- it starts up randomly, usually it gets better if left plugged in for a few hours
- sometimes the boot sequence stops (light goes from blinking red to blinking white and then it shuts down)

Do you have any diagnostic procedure to follow?

I know that sometimes the PSU fails and I am aware of the ATX conversion kit offered by kubatyszko but before going down that road I would like to make sure that I do not have problems somewhere else, i.e. motherboard.

Right now the machine has stopped booting at all.
 

Elf

Storybook
Feb 4, 2019
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See page 110 of the Fuel Hardware Owner's Guide (attached) which gives some diagnostic ideas.

The L1 controller (via the "L1 diagnostic port") may also yield some clues and more verbose error messages. I have never tried the USB L1 port on a Fuel, but it's possible @massiverobot or @LarBob may have some tips on how to use it.
 

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Effediesse

New member
Aug 4, 2020
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Northern Italy
Thanks a lot, a very interesting document.

I will get a "RS232 usb null-modem cable for L1 connection" to perform more diagnostics, that cable is also needed to install the ATX conversion kit by kubatyszko so it's better to have it around...
 

Effediesse

New member
Aug 4, 2020
11
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3
Northern Italy
I've been able to start the Fuel once and it worked perfectly for 20 minutes and then it started the shutdown procedure giving this message:

IMG_9808.jpg

Any suggestions?
 

Elf

Storybook
Feb 4, 2019
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Looks like power supply issues; 12V and 3.3V come directly from the supply, afaik
 

Effediesse

New member
Aug 4, 2020
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Northern Italy
Good, at least I know that the problem is likely in the PSU.
I will get the cable for the L1 connection today and I will post the results.....
 

Effediesse

New member
Aug 4, 2020
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Northern Italy
I have been able to get a L1 response for a brief period of time:

001a01 ATTN: XIO 3.3V aux low fault limit reached 2.322V.
001a01 ATTN: brick auto power down in 30 seconds
001a01 ATTN: brick auto power down in 25 seconds
001a01 ATTN: brick auto power down in 20 seconds
001a01 ATTN: brick auto power down in 15 seconds
001a01 ATTN: brick auto power down in 10 seconds
001a01 ATTN: brick auto power down in 5 seconds
001a01 ATTN: brick is powering down now!
 

weblacky

New member
Jan 13, 2020
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Seattle, WA
Yeap, PSU. that's what we see in Fuels and Tezros with PSU issues and possible mainboard caps going on any built-in DC/DC converters onboard. Voltages start OK. Then as load is added during boot-up of software, voltage dips, and dips, and oops out of safe range!

Yeap PSU first. That will likely fix it.
 
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Effediesse

New member
Aug 4, 2020
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Northern Italy
Great.

I've just bought the ATX PSU adapter from kubatyszko and currently looking for the right PSU which is going to be the more expensive part I guess.

Can anybody confirm that I need at least 30A on +5v and +3.3v?
 

Elf

Storybook
Feb 4, 2019
336
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Yes, ideally; but none of the modern ATX PSUs will meet that spec (most of the wattage has been allocated to 12V now).

Although not mentioned in his Fuel PSU replacement thread, I think @massiverobot has had success with the "Rosewill Quark 1200" ATX supply. It only claims 120W total amongst 3.3V@25A and 5V@22A, but it seems to work for him in practice :)

Edit: actual supply posted below
 
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massiverobot

irix detailer
Feb 8, 2019
93
57
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Philly
twitter.com
I didn't post the actual PSU? I should edit that then. Yeah, I just got a decent reviewed PSU hoping that the 5/3 volts are at least a bit over engineered on a good big PSU. I've had the Rosewill TOKAMAK 1200 1200W Continuous (from Amazon) now for at least 6 months? I run the fuel 24/7 and it's been rock solid.


Tokamak specs (from amazon page:)
• Output: +3.3V@25A,+5V@22A,+12V@100A,-12V@0.3A,+5VSB@3A
• MTBF:100k hours at 25°C, 80% load
 
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Effediesse

New member
Aug 4, 2020
11
1
3
Northern Italy
Very interesting, I missed that thread somehow.

Good to know that the Rosewill PSU is working fine 24/7, I am not able to get it here in Italy (S&H plus custom duties are really expensive), the Corsair HX1200 here is "just" 250 euro but still very expensive, I got the Fuel and the F180 monitor for 100 euro so spending a lot of money on it just for sentimental reasons does not make any sense.

I love to keep it in good shape and working so I will try with a Corsair VS550 (+3.3V 20 A, +5V 24 A) that I had for free, I know it's not the perfect PSU but my Fuel is a low-spec machine with just one HD and I only intend to power it up once a week so I guess that it will be enough (Kuba confirmed that and I will be monitoring values on L1 to make sure everything is fine).

Thanks again for your help, I'll keep the thread updated as soon as I get the adapter from Kuba.
 
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LarBob

Administrator
Feb 8, 2019
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The L1 controller (via the "L1 diagnostic port") may also yield some clues and more verbose error messages. I have never tried the USB L1 port on a Fuel, but it's possible @massiverobot or @LarBob may have some tips on how to use it.
I think you need an L2 controller for the USB L1 port on the Fuel/Origins. I think you'd basically have set it in a rack and access the L1 on multiple machines through it (I've never had one, so don't quote me on that).
 

Effediesse

New member
Aug 4, 2020
11
1
3
Northern Italy
I think you need an L2 controller for the USB L1 port on the Fuel/Origins. I think you'd basically have set it in a rack and access the L1 on multiple machines through it (I've never had one, so don't quote me on that).
I think you are right, AFAIK you need some kind of special software to access L1 through the USB port (as kuba told me), I am currently accessing L1 through a RS232-to-USB cable.
 

kubatyszko

New member
Jan 29, 2020
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Oh hai,
the USB port on the back requires software that some of us have in possession, I installed mine on an old Red Hat Linux VM, and in fact this is my primary way of interacting with one of my Fuel's where I broke the L1 socket onboard.
Btw, Effediesse found some old PSU that matched the requirements, not buying a new one.
 
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